Posted 2/28/2011 21:31 (#1642645) Subject: John Deere 466 engine questions
I have a late JD 4450 powershift mfwd tractor. It needs a different motor, because the last guy who tried to fix the head gasket leak used the wrong head bolts, and now there is water in the oil big time.
This motor uses a gear driven water pump, and has the front mounted water outlet/fan mount.
I have found several very low hour combine engines..(7720's) for very reasonable $$.
I am aware that these engines use a belt drive water pump. I am wanting to swap the timing cover and water pump off the 4450's original engine, and convert the combine engine. Also needed of course would be the proper oil pump, because the oil pan will stay with the tractor, and it's a different depth. I would also change the front balancer, to keep the stock belt locations, front water outlet/fan support, block the 2 water outlets on top of head.
I will make sure I purchase one of these engines with the crankshaft driven oil pump.
There are 2 concerns:
1. frame rail mounting holes. we all know JD used 4 bolts on the front of the block rail, and 2 on the rear. There is an additional 2 holes midway on the 4450 frame rail for a total of 8 per side. Not all blocks are drilled/tapped for those middle 2 holes. The actual 'boss' is there, but not always drilled. These holes could be drilled and tapped here in the farm shop.
2. if in fact the newer style front timing cover (with the gear driven water pump and magnetic tach pick up) will bolt up to the front of the block. I have been told there may not be all the necessary 'locating dowels' for the front cover to hang on. I wont know until I pull this engine out and dismantle.
If all goes well, a handful of gaskets will all that is needed to swap these pieces from the 4450 engine, over to the donor engine out of the combine.
I know the idle speed will be slightly higher in the comine engine, ( I always thought the idle speed was a tad slow in JD anyway) One benefit will be the higher horsepower the combine engine will give.
Anyone have any other thoughts, advice or input on some of these issues? my main snag right now is the front cover adaptability.
Posted 2/28/2011 23:07 (#1642940 - in reply to #1642843) Subject: Re: John Deere 466 engine questions
I too agree, IF there was anything worth rebuilding! This thing originally came back to the USA from Germany. Before I get jumped here, It was built in Waterloo, and exported to Germany. It was brought back here for resale. Has had numerous bouts of head leakage for over 15 years. and has had the head, block shaved at least once. Done @ the dealer once, and a independant once. New head, New overhaul, and finally the last guy put the wrong bolts in the block and it pulled the threads. Is it worth rebuilding? maybe, maybenot. They couldn't do it the first or second time around! This thing has been overheated big time. Air doesnt pump worth a dang through the water pump...
Nothing will piss a guy off like finding your tractor 'steaming' across the field with a know it all hired hand at the wheel.
with minimal machine work, I could rebuild this engine for less than $3000. With the thread repair to the block, new cam, lifters, and probably injection pump. (they like clean good oil too) oil pump, add another 2000-3000.... would you be ready to gamble?? I say cut bait and row to shore.
a modern 466 'ready to run for a 4450' (used) is about 6000 this week. With a butt load of hours too.
I might be totally surprised when I disassemble this engine next week....and find a totally rebuildable engine! I was just trying to be prepared for the worst.
Posted 3/1/2011 05:40 (#1643217 - in reply to #1642940) Subject: Re: John Deere 466 engine questions
It sounds like you know what you have, and I would agree that it is probably time to start over with a different chunk of iron. "Here", I bought a good used takeout engine from a late 6620 for $3500 exchange(about 3 yrs ago). This engine went in my 4440, I ended up swapping side rails for 4450 ones rather than re-do all the mounting holes. $6K for a used engine sounds high, unless that market has shot up the last couple years.
Posted 2/28/2011 23:12 (#1642954 - in reply to #1642938) Subject: RE: John Deere 466 engine questions
yes. coolant trails down the side of the block, and bigtime pressure in the radiator, just seconds after starting... Not to mention the steam coming from between the head and block.
I can see what you are saying..... a bad seal will put coolant directly in the crankcase!
Posted 3/1/2011 07:50 (#1643322 - in reply to #1642645) Subject: Re: John Deere 466 engine questions
NW Ohio,near Findlay
I have learned on this post, I never knew that many things are different on combine motors, water pump, oil pump and pan. My question is why did Deere do that? Wouldn't it been cheaper to design the combine to accept the tractor motor, one fits all, build mounts to make it fit, or is this not possible in a combine. Just wondered why.
Posted 3/1/2011 08:12 (#1643370 - in reply to #1643322) Subject: Re: John Deere 466 engine questions
I would call TTP engine rebuilders located on US 30 in Northern Indiana. Can't remenber the name of town. They could help you out with your problem. They have all kinds of engines already majored and ready to bolt in your tractor frame.(exchange).
Posted 3/1/2011 08:16 (#1643380 - in reply to #1642645) Subject: RE: John Deere 466 engine questions
Is the vibration dampener off the combine compatable with the flywheel on the tractor ?I realise that it will bolt up ,but that doesn't mean they're friends . I bet a busted crank would really piss you off .
Posted 3/1/2011 09:07 (#1643486 - in reply to #1642645) Subject: RE: John Deere 466 engine questions
I would not screw with a used combine engine and then have to go to a bunch of work to get it to fit.
Just go to Abiline or Cooks and get a Long Block with a 1 year warrentee and be running in just a little over a day. Jon
Posted 4/22/2011 23:06 (#1739744 - in reply to #1642645) Subject: Re: John Deere 466 engine questions
paid 3500 for a 1690 hour 466, out of a Titan 2 combine
500 to have the injector pump built into a 'tractor' pump, (throttle lever put on other side of pump, and put in the tractor governor)
about $120 for the gaskets to swap all the 'tractor only' parts over to the replacement engine
Idles with 50 psi oil, runs out @60psi
even without the aneroid, it starts right up with authority, and the extra 20 horses arent unwelcome either.